Local Weather

by Happy HarperValley Rez

In the thread...
For those who voted NO
Main Street Monroe | Profile | Active Topics | Members | Search | FAQ
 All Forums
 Community Issues
 Monroe Local Schools
 Election Results

Note: You must be registered in order to post a reply.

Screensize:
UserName:
Password:
Message:

* HTML is ON
* Forum Code is OFF
Smilies
Smile [:)] Big Smile [:D] Cool [8D] Blush [:I]
Tongue [:P] Evil [):] Wink [;)] Clown [:o)]
Black Eye [B)] Eight Ball [8] Frown [:(] Shy [8)]
Shocked [:0] Angry [:(!] Dead [xx(] Sleepy [|)]
Kisses [:X] Approve [^] Disapprove [V] Question [?]

 
   

T O P I C    R E V I E W
taurus Posted - 08/07/2012 : 8:19:59 PM
Issue 3 MONROE SCHOOLS Contest Detail Map
0 of 9 Precincts Reporting
Percent Votes
FOR THE TAX LEVY (NP) 43.14% 66
AGAINST THE TAX LEVY (NP) 56.86% 87

Total 153

UPDATE ON YOUR OWN

40   L A T E S T    R E P L I E S    (Newest First)
Happy HarperValley Rez Posted - 08/09/2012 : 10:09:47 AM
But I think it is possible if everyone can exchange ideas and keep the emotions in check. I know that is hard -very hard under the circumstances for both sides. But we have to keep in mind that we all really want the same things...
Accountability of our Elected Board and Superintendent
Financial discretion and responsible spending (In these times, everyone has had to cut back from things we were able to do 8 yrs ago. So we have to take short term options instead of trying to spend for 10 yrs out - the Admin Bldg - dumb dumb dumb expense - should have worked out of trailers, old school, etc until we could afford to make such a purchase/debt)
Transparency in what things cost, how they are funded and where they should be paid from.
Public vote for major purchases (like the stadium and Admin Bldgs etc)
And I could go on and on but I am just trying to emphasise some of the issues we need to discuss as a community to move forward.

This is OUR community, yes and no voters! And we can solve this if everyone stops arguing and tries listening to each other...
Again JMO!

quote:
[i]Originally posted by zapp2525[/i]
[br]I think most want the same outcome, how we get there is the hard part.

zapp2525 Posted - 08/09/2012 : 09:55:46 AM
I think most want the same outcome, how we get there is the hard part.
Happy HarperValley Rez Posted - 08/09/2012 : 09:51:29 AM
Let me try to explain it one more time and hopefully for the last time...
I do not want to argue, bicker or fight with anyone.
I tried all day yesterday to encourage people to calm down and not argue - try to listen and find common ground to work from to move forward (see conversation with Vegasmayor)
and now for your belittling thoughts...
"Stuck your nose in it" -the post was not involving you so that was true statement and not belittling
"Please get a life" - this was a polite request for you to do something productive
"Here is another hobby for you" - this was a play on your chosen screen name with a viable suggestion to change the Nov results

None of those remarks were belittling! I am sorry if you did not get it.

And here is a bonus,
I do not read a certain posters posts because they have nothing to offer (IMO) that is interesting or adds value.
When things did not go their way before, they cried, kicked, moaned, belittled John, tried to enlist others to go to a site designed to punish John and he eventually found that no one there cared for him either so he came back here under multiple screen names.
I have not placed you or anyone else on ignore.
What my age has to do with it I have no idea but I am a proud 48

All I tried to do all day yesterday was not to be someone who said "na na na na nahhh we won!" because the sad truth is no one won. The opposing side of the issue got out and was heard with their vote. That simple!

Now is the time for attempts at resolving the issues that are between us and find a reasonable way to make this work - for everyone. And we can't do this if everyone needs to take pot shots at each other and suggest people leave (I did not initiate that - I responded to what was tossed at me in anger).

After this final attempt on my behalf to reach out to move forward - it is in your hands how we proceed. And that is all that is in my power to do.



quote:
[i]Originally posted by Too Many Hobbies[/i]
I believe this is a public forum, so I can put my views in as I please, whether you like it or not.

Regarding belittling of others, here are your quotes:

"Stuck your nose in it"
"Please get a life"
"Here is another hobby for you"

That is only from ONE post. I can go on with what you have posted recently.

Just sayin'.....

skydiver Posted - 08/08/2012 : 11:25:11 PM
quote:
[i]Originally posted by Mike_Irwin[/i]
[br]Tom B.

Sorry I didn't get a break down from you or the info on the additional information about finding money from the State. Thank you for clearing it up and explaining in detail.

If you recall, you had to go out the door and finished with just answering two questions, I asked (no details) How much was the original contract for and how much did we pay total. You did not tell me we paid $2 million for the land. I assumed (wrongly) that it was in the original contract.

Thanks for clarifying it for me.



T.

MRI




WOW, Your Creds Just Went Out The Window

Thanks Tom B
Les Lofton Posted - 08/08/2012 : 11:13:54 PM
My take on the school issue is that most expenses will not get cut much and that the district will go deeper and deeper in debt to the state. In the meantime, we will have a levy proposal at every election until we either pass a levy or until the state forces a consolidation with another district. The only alternatives that I see as likely are 1) We raise our taxes and maintain our independence or 2) We get consolidated and get our taxes raised. I feel that those of us who voted "No" thinking that drastic spending cuts would take place will be sorely disappointed as the debt piles up as most of the spending continues under state supervision.
Les Lofton Posted - 08/08/2012 : 10:48:03 PM
quote:
[i]Originally posted by Mike_Irwin[/i]
[br]It isn't a question of NOT keeping it running.

Rather it is how the school has been ran since it broke away from Middletown.

Just to throw out an interesting statistic:
  • Public approved $29 million bond levy to build that new school complex on the hill.

    • Original bid was for $29.8 million (from Tom B. today)
    • Actual cost to build around $34 million (also from Tom B. today)

So let me see, the public approved $29 million and the actual cost was approximately $5 million more than approved by the public.

The reason why this is true is irrelevant - the fact is we (the collective body of Monroe Local Schools) spent more than authorized by the public.

Seems that we started in the hole without anticipation of future costs.

Of course add the other costs for sports complex, etc. - again without public approval.

Until this crisis arose, most people thought we were doing OK (like we were told by the school district) and although we consistently overspent (year after year) all was obviously OK.

MRI



Since the public never voted to approve the cost of the construction, you can not say that "the actual cost was approximately $5 million more than approved by the public." The public voted on the bond levy to approve the debt the district could incur and did not vote on how much could be spent on construction projects. I would have thought that as a former board member or at least as an informed voter, you would have grasped this distinction before making such a misrepresentation.
Dannyboy Posted - 08/08/2012 : 10:31:09 PM
quote:
[i]Originally posted by cmsquare[/i]
[br]
quote:
[i]Originally posted by mom4kids[/i]
[br]A child's education does not suffer because student/teacher ratios increase.



Really?????????


and what exactly do you base that on?





http://blogs.ajc.com/get-schooled-blog/2010/05/19/latest-study-reducing-class-size-doesnt-benefit-student-achievement/

Mixed results.
Mike_Irwin Posted - 08/08/2012 : 10:14:02 PM
Tom B.

Sorry I didn't get a break down from you or the info on the additional information about finding money from the State. Thank you for clearing it up and explaining in detail.

If you recall, you had to go out the door and finished with just answering two questions, I asked (no details) How much was the original contract for and how much did we pay total. You did not tell me we paid $2 million for the land. I assumed (wrongly) that it was in the original contract.

Thanks for clarifying it for me.

MRI
bubbles Posted - 08/08/2012 : 9:51:13 PM
6th grade may be a little old for holding hands.

Age was not mentioned but I think graduated class sizes could be useful as an cost saving measure. By the time the kids are in high school a class size of 40 or even 45-1 would help acclimate them to the higher education system and save the district money.

While we are fortunate to be a small school, many students the product of major cities such as New York, Chicago & LA get a good education and graduate with honors with little one on one attention and large class sizes.
cmsquare Posted - 08/08/2012 : 9:33:26 PM
quote:
[i]Originally posted by bubbles[/i]
[br]
quote:
[i]Originally posted by cmsquare[/i]
[br]
quote:
[i]Originally posted by mom4kids[/i]
[br]A child's education does not suffer because student/teacher ratios increase.



Really?????????

and what exactly do you base that on?




College? That first freshman class at OSU is going to be a real shocker when you share the English prof with 300 other kids.



Oh Ok

so you are comparing 18-22 year olds and how they act in a classroom when they have made the voluntary choice to be there to a classroom filled with 50 12 year olds forced to attend school every day.

and I'm being generous by using a 12 year old as an example. I bet those kids get lots of 1 on 1 development time when there are 50 kids and 1 teacher. Oh who cares...they don't hold hands in college so why should we in 6th grade?>

LOL

you are VERY realistic I must say.





bubbles Posted - 08/08/2012 : 9:24:03 PM
quote:
[i]Originally posted by cmsquare[/i]
[br]
quote:
[i]Originally posted by mom4kids[/i]
[br]A child's education does not suffer because student/teacher ratios increase.



Really?????????

and what exactly do you base that on?




College? That first freshman class at OSU is going to be a real shocker when you share the English prof with 300 other kids.
cmsquare Posted - 08/08/2012 : 8:47:15 PM
quote:
[i]Originally posted by mom4kids[/i]
[br]A child's education does not suffer because student/teacher ratios increase.



Really?????????


and what exactly do you base that on?

mom4kids Posted - 08/08/2012 : 7:40:02 PM
Where was I? Minding my budget, canceling cable, the Y, and cell phones for the kids (BEFORE a hole was dug).

Its hard to change how business is done in the home and outside. But you do what you have to do. A child's education does not suffer because student/teacher ratios increase. A child's education does not suffer when they can't play sports or sing songs and learn an instrument. Success comes from the home - NOT from a school district and magic boards. My gosh, last year my kids hardly had books to bring home - but I found the information they needed to READ teaching them research techniques at the same time.

Just do your job as the election results require and take action, no said it would be pleasant. Also - the success of the levy would not have improved the situation, it would just stall the consequence.

Take the loss, merge with another school district and move on.


quote:
[i]Originally posted by Tom B[/i]
[br]
quote:
[i]Originally posted by mom4kids[/i]
[br]Its funny that if the levy passed, it would never see the light of day on another ballot. Respect the results I say!



I would love to. But the fact is that we simply don't know how to stretch the budget to do so, and still meet the requirements of the law in education, keep our kids safe, pay off the existing debt that must be repaid, etc.

This is exactly why I repeatedly volunteered to meet with anyone in Monroe for 6 months. I signed up to to listen to your real ideas of how services (costs) can be cut, specific ideas, not platitudes and mantras, and to share the reality of how difficult doing so can be in some cases. Just one person accepted the offer. No groups did. ONE.

So to everyone posting here that they wanted more information, I shared it here earlier, and repeatedly volunteered to come to your homes, even one person at a time, to discuss it. And to listen. Where were you?

Tom B Posted - 08/08/2012 : 7:23:40 PM
quote:
[i]Originally posted by mom4kids[/i]
[br]Its funny that if the levy passed, it would never see the light of day on another ballot. Respect the results I say!



I would love to. But the fact is that we simply don't know how to stretch the budget to do so, and still meet the requirements of the law in education, keep our kids safe, pay off the existing debt that must be repaid, etc.

This is exactly why I repeatedly volunteered to meet with anyone in Monroe for 6 months. I signed up to to listen to your real ideas of how services (costs) can be cut, specific ideas, not platitudes and mantras, and to share the reality of how difficult doing so can be in some cases. Just one person accepted the offer. No groups did. ONE.

So to everyone posting here that they wanted more information, I shared it here earlier, and repeatedly volunteered to come to your homes, even one person at a time, to discuss it. And to listen. Where were you?
Tom B Posted - 08/08/2012 : 7:02:28 PM
quote:
[i]Originally posted by Mike_Irwin[/i]
[br]

Just to throw out an interesting statistic:
  • Public approved $29 million bond levy to build that new school complex on the hill.

    • Original bid was for $29.8 million (from Tom B. today)
    • Actual cost to build around $34 million (also from Tom B. today)

So let me see, the public approved $29 million and the actual cost was approximately $5 million more than approved by the public.



If you are going to use my information Mike, use it fairly. You know the $34M figure included the nearly $2M paid for the land before the school was approved and built, and that the rest was from increasing the size of the building and facilities when additional state money was made available for us to do so. NO ADDITIONAL DEBT WAS PUT UPON THE COMMUNITY FROM THIS. NONE.

The original contracted work was for $29.8 million. It cost a total of that plus just $250,000 to complete the work in the bid contract, what was promised to the public in the bond issue. In fact, the only overrun on the entire project was because when they began the excavation they found several natural springs that required extensive water diversion with piping. And they had to haul out a HUGE amount of additional soil, dry it, then put it back, and compact it before starting the foundations and floors. That was the only OVERRUN one the whole project, a grand total of 0.8%. How the heck we could have projected finding natural springs at the TOP of a hill is beyond me.

Despite TWICE having major sections of walls (the tall ones along the gym) blown down by massive storms before they could be secured and protected with other structures, the project came in only 6 weeks late, which was incredible in a time of massive construction, and the resulting material and labor shortages the project faced then.

As for the rest, from the beginning, limitations in state laws prevented us from borrowing enough money to build the size of school that was needed. As I explained to you today, the most any district was then permitted to borrow was 9% of the total assessed value of the district. That yielded only $26M. We appealed because of our unique situation as a new district and were granted a one time permission to go to 12%, taking us to $29.8M. That STILL would not permit the size of school needed, but it was all we cold borrow. It passed with 67% of voters approving. We bid the contract, and brought it in within $250K of that.

AFTER the project was bid, Arnie Elam found a way to get several million dollars in additional support from the state, in cash, not debt. We invested some of it in additional classrooms, the junior high gym to address great public concerns of inappropriate age mixing of junior high and high school kids, and all of the original sports fields work except the stadium and field houses done later. That let us run all daily practices at the new site instead of bearing the pain of moving kids every day from site to site. And it was ALWAYS in the long term plan presented to the voters. Finally, as I told you, the $34M also included the nearly $2M we paid in cash for the land before any of the project started.

Our phone calls are over Mike if this is how you are going to misrepresent what I share with you.
mom4kids Posted - 08/08/2012 : 6:53:00 PM
Its funny that if the levy passed, it would never see the light of day on another ballot. Respect the results I say!



quote:
[i]Originally posted by Dannyboy[/i]
[br]
quote:
[i]Originally posted by cmsquare[/i]
[br]I do wonder what would have been "Achieved" if your no votes win.

there will be another levy....more money spent....so really..what did you achieve?

Sure you would have succeeded in your finger pointing campaign, but your wallet won't end up being any fatter in the long run.




This argument assumes the taxpayers aren't allowed to make a decision, and the proper role of government is to just keep putting levies on the ballot until one passes. That's not very democratic.

The people voted. The levy failed. Elections have consequences. The next step is up to the board (possibly more cuts) and the state (possible consolidation). If the people of Monroe don't want a levy, then they will get something else.

bobpreston Posted - 08/08/2012 : 6:44:26 PM
quote:
[i]Originally posted by cmsquare[/i]
[br]

If ever there was a statement that proves we need to properly fund out schools THIS is it.

In fact I think this is my official slogan for the upcoming pro-levy stance in November.

Thank you.

I am a beliver


What will it say look you dumped millions into the school and they are still putting out an inferior product so give us millions more for the failures of our past.
Overpaid teachers does not equal quality education!
cmsquare Posted - 08/08/2012 : 6:40:58 PM
quote:
[i]Originally posted by Steve Black[/i]
[br]Ugh. Nevermind.



It's like playing tennis with a wall.

cmsquare Posted - 08/08/2012 : 6:38:32 PM
Now now. You are using way too many facts and well thought out points. How dare you speak to her like that.

It's much easier for her to just put you on ignore...watch.

Anyone who remotely disagrees with her she just puts on ignore. That should give you some insight to the level of maturity you are dealing with here. Now if I told you how old she REALLY was...then you would have a laugh.


quote:
[i]Originally posted by Too Many Hobbies[/i]
[br]
quote:
[i]Originally posted by Happy HarperValley Rez[/i]
[br]Since you were not involved in that discussion but stuck your nose in it...
Please get a life!
I am sick and tired of people thinking we are haters to have voted no....Demon villagers that we are...
You have done nothing but cry and moan all day and spit venom leading up to the vote. I could do without you and your venom personally but I suppose you are basing this on the values and common decency you were raised with.

I have a right to respond when I have been asked to leave because my opinion opposes your own and I feel that banter was attacking and highly disrespectful so I responded in kind.

I have also had enough of you and your belittling of the no voters.
Here is another hobby for you - talk to the other parents who did not get out and vote for their kids! I exercised my right - 1 vote and now you will attack me relentlessly for my vote and difference of opinion. Do something positive and gather your supporters and go for it in Nov! Good luck to you in your new venture - all I can do is show you the map....I cannot make you take it...

Just sayin...

quote:
[i]Originally posted by Too Many Hobbies[/i]
[br]
quote:
[i]Originally posted by Happy HarperValley Rez[/i]
[br]Or even better... YOU could move to a community that can afford your wants and let those of us born and raised here keep our homes and neighbors... just sayin

quote:
[i]Originally posted by zapp2525[/i]
[br]If you can't afford $30 a month then maybe you are living in the wrong place, maybe find one you could afford and not hold back the community your currently living in.





Unfortunately for you and us, we are here, and not able to leave easily. We cannot turn back time, so we are trying to find a way out of this.

I guess we are just not good enough the be here since we were not born and raised here. Nice of you If you want to go with that viewpoint, why don't you demolish your house and give the land back to the Indians.





I believe this is a public forum, so I can put my views in as I please, whether you like it or not.

Regarding belittling of others, here are your quotes:

"Stuck your nose in it"
"Please get a life"
"Here is another hobby for you"

That is only from ONE post. I can go on with what you have posted recently.

Just sayin'.....

cmsquare Posted - 08/08/2012 : 6:04:53 PM
quote:
[i]Originally posted by sunflower23[/i]
[br]You can't reason with the haters,Harper Valley. They belive they are the only ones needed to govern Monroe.I voted NO just because I can.And there is not a damn thing they can do about it. 1123 citizens are all stupid,lazy,etc? Just because they don't think like the TRUE BELIVERS.




If ever there was a statement that proves we need to properly fund out schools THIS is it.

In fact I think this is my official slogan for the upcoming pro-levy stance in November.

Thank you.

I am a beliver
zapp2525 Posted - 08/08/2012 : 5:12:43 PM
You can't fix stupid
Too Many Hobbies Posted - 08/08/2012 : 5:00:03 PM
quote:
[i]Originally posted by Happy HarperValley Rez[/i]
[br]Since you were not involved in that discussion but stuck your nose in it...
Please get a life!
I am sick and tired of people thinking we are haters to have voted no....Demon villagers that we are...
You have done nothing but cry and moan all day and spit venom leading up to the vote. I could do without you and your venom personally but I suppose you are basing this on the values and common decency you were raised with.

I have a right to respond when I have been asked to leave because my opinion opposes your own and I feel that banter was attacking and highly disrespectful so I responded in kind.

I have also had enough of you and your belittling of the no voters.
Here is another hobby for you - talk to the other parents who did not get out and vote for their kids! I exercised my right - 1 vote and now you will attack me relentlessly for my vote and difference of opinion. Do something positive and gather your supporters and go for it in Nov! Good luck to you in your new venture - all I can do is show you the map....I cannot make you take it...

Just sayin...

quote:
[i]Originally posted by Too Many Hobbies[/i]
[br]
quote:
[i]Originally posted by Happy HarperValley Rez[/i]
[br]Or even better... YOU could move to a community that can afford your wants and let those of us born and raised here keep our homes and neighbors... just sayin

quote:
[i]Originally posted by zapp2525[/i]
[br]If you can't afford $30 a month then maybe you are living in the wrong place, maybe find one you could afford and not hold back the community your currently living in.





Unfortunately for you and us, we are here, and not able to leave easily. We cannot turn back time, so we are trying to find a way out of this.

I guess we are just not good enough the be here since we were not born and raised here. Nice of you If you want to go with that viewpoint, why don't you demolish your house and give the land back to the Indians.





I believe this is a public forum, so I can put my views in as I please, whether you like it or not.

Regarding belittling of others, here are your quotes:

"Stuck your nose in it"
"Please get a life"
"Here is another hobby for you"

That is only from ONE post. I can go on with what you have posted recently.

Just sayin'.....
sunflower23 Posted - 08/08/2012 : 4:38:34 PM
You can't reason with the haters,Harper Valley. They belive they are the only ones needed to govern Monroe.I voted NO just because I can.And there is not a damn thing they can do about it. 1123 citizens are all stupid,lazy,etc? Just because they don't think like the CHOOSEN FEW.
Happy HarperValley Rez Posted - 08/08/2012 : 4:21:43 PM
Thanks for the understanding Vegasmayor! And I hate that you got that response, unfortunately a small percentage may feel just that way. I do not nor do the people I spoke with who voted no.
We all care even if some think the no voters or childless HH do not!
We need to calm down!
It is what I have been trying to say over and over again all day!
We need to come together, find common ground and work together for a resolution that we can all live with.

I truly appreciate you asking and then truly listening. If more of us could do this we might just save our schools together and for the better.

Again, JMO!
quote:
[i]Originally posted by vegasmayor[/i]
[br]Thank you, HHVR. I appreciate the fact that you have good suggestions and have actually thought it through. I have a co-worker, and Monroe resident, that simply gave me the answer, "I don't care. They need to find a way out. I don't have kids in Monroe schools so I just voted no so I wouldn't have to pay more." Nice, huh?

I realized some are uninformed, misinformed, or simply too lazy to be informed at all. And I also realize you are not one of those people. Tensions can get high when we're talking kids or money. Mix the two and it can be downright explosive. But I really do appreciate your views.



Happy HarperValley Rez Posted - 08/08/2012 : 4:01:17 PM
Since you were not involved in that discussion but stuck your nose in it...
Please get a life!
I am sick and tired of people thinking we are haters to have voted no....Demon villagers that we are...
You have done nothing but cry and moan all day and spit venom leading up to the vote. I could do without you and your venom personally but I suppose you are basing this on the values and common decency you were raised with.

I have a right to respond when I have been asked to leave because my opinion opposes your own and I feel that banter was attacking and highly disrespectful so I responded in kind.

I have also had enough of you and your belittling of the no voters.
Here is another hobby for you - talk to the other parents who did not get out and vote for their kids! I exercised my right - 1 vote and now you will attack me relentlessly for my vote and difference of opinion. Do something positive and gather your supporters and go for it in Nov! Good luck to you in your new venture - all I can do is show you the map....I cannot make you take it...

Just sayin...

quote:
[i]Originally posted by Too Many Hobbies[/i]
[br]
quote:
[i]Originally posted by Happy HarperValley Rez[/i]
[br]Or even better... YOU could move to a community that can afford your wants and let those of us born and raised here keep our homes and neighbors... just sayin

quote:
[i]Originally posted by zapp2525[/i]
[br]If you can't afford $30 a month then maybe you are living in the wrong place, maybe find one you could afford and not hold back the community your currently living in.





Unfortunately for you and us, we are here, and not able to leave easily. We cannot turn back time, so we are trying to find a way out of this.

I guess we are just not good enough the be here since we were not born and raised here. Nice of you If you want to go with that viewpoint, why don't you demolish your house and give the land back to the Indians.

vegasmayor Posted - 08/08/2012 : 3:59:39 PM
Thank you, HHVR. I appreciate the fact that you have good suggestions and have actually thought it through. I have a co-worker, and Monroe resident, that simply gave me the answer, "I don't care. They need to find a way out. I don't have kids in Monroe schools so I just voted no so I wouldn't have to pay more." Nice, huh?

I realized some are uninformed, misinformed, or simply too lazy to be informed at all. And I also realize you are not one of those people. Tensions can get high when we're talking kids or money. Mix the two and it can be downright explosive. But I really do appreciate your views.

Happy HarperValley Rez Posted - 08/08/2012 : 3:48:47 PM
I will answer honestly and I am trusting that you posed the question as you said - honest as well.
I don't have a quick solution if I did - I should be the next Prez of the country cause I could fix that as well.

I think there needs to be a levy passed. Please do not be shocked by that..but with that said, I think in order to pass one it needs to be transparent as to what exactly we pay for the cost for each item (not to the penny but also not broad brushed either), I think the Super needs to offer a 5 yr salary reduction (like the teachers took cuts) as a good faith measure (it was on her watch); I think that we should look at the Admin staffing and see if there are ways to cut it to the bare minimum, I think we should liquidate some assets - like the Berns prop that should never have been purchased; I think "pay to play" is an unfortunate and necessary evil (created by those with loftier dreams than dollars in pocket); I think busing should be looked at (again unfortunate but necessary to get this), I also think that we should look at the contracts for services (it seems while Middletown saved money by hooking with us - our costs went up over what we paid alone last year) and then I think we need to see a solid plan for going forward.

I believe some or all of those ideas would go a long way in gaining trust from the community and the amount could be lower for a longer time for the levy (to help make it affordable until the economy comes back).

And that Vegasmayor is honestly what I think could be done.
I tried to be thoughtful and fair.


quote:
[i]Originally posted by vegasmayor[/i]
[br]HHVR,

Honest question. Not trying to bait you. I honestly wonder, how do you think this debt is going to be paid? We can all agree that we are in a mess. We can all agree that there is blame and if we could do it differently, we would. But starting from where we are now, how do you think the debt should be paid? It's A LOT of money.

Itsforthekids Posted - 08/08/2012 : 3:38:44 PM
You hit that nail on the head! Agreed

quote:
[i]Originally posted by cmsquare[/i]
[br]Right...because unless you were born here you couldn't possibly know what is best for Monroe.

Ladies and gentleman, it is this underlying mentality in some that is the root of the very problem facing us now.




quote:
[i]Originally posted by Happy HarperValley Rez[/i]
[br]Or even better... YOU could move to a community that can afford your wants and let those of us born and raised here keep our homes and neighbors... just sayin





[/quote]
cmsquare Posted - 08/08/2012 : 3:31:22 PM
Right...because unless you were born here you couldn't possibly know what is best for Monroe.

Ladies and gentleman this is this underlying mentality in some that is the root of the very problem facing us.

Do you want to stay stuck in the past or do you want to move forward?




quote:
[i]Originally posted by Happy HarperValley Rez[/i]
[br]Or even better... YOU could move to a community that can afford your wants and let those of us born and raised here keep our homes and neighbors... just sayin



[/quote]
zapp2525 Posted - 08/08/2012 : 3:25:21 PM
At some point taxes will be going up, and if you can't afford them you will have no other choice but to move to a place you can afford.
Too Many Hobbies Posted - 08/08/2012 : 2:59:59 PM
quote:
[i]Originally posted by Happy HarperValley Rez[/i]
[br]Or even better... YOU could move to a community that can afford your wants and let those of us born and raised here keep our homes and neighbors... just sayin

quote:
[i]Originally posted by zapp2525[/i]
[br]If you can't afford $30 a month then maybe you are living in the wrong place, maybe find one you could afford and not hold back the community your currently living in.





Unfortunately for you and us, we are here, and not able to leave easily. We cannot turn back time, so we are trying to find a way out of this.

I guess we are just not good enough the be here since we were not born and raised here. Nice of you If you want to go with that viewpoint, why don't you demolish your house and give the land back to the Indians.
Too Many Hobbies Posted - 08/08/2012 : 2:54:05 PM
quote:
[i]Originally posted by vegasmayor[/i]
[br]
quote:
[i]Originally posted by Happy HarperValley Rez[/i]
[br]And I am still baffled by the people who refuse to understand that some people cannot afford it! Seniors are on a fixed income. As the economy gets better, their out of pockets expenses (gas, food, medical costs) naturally reduce somewhat. Also, their investments (pensions, stocks, 401k plans) see a boost - thus giving them more options and more cash. A boost in the economy does lead to larger raises for some, job opportunities for the unemployed, single income households have an opportunity to become 2 income households again, the housing foreclosures would be reduced and the people have options to invest and diversify to gain income opportunities.

While $20 or $ 30 a month is nothing for you (congratulations on your good fortune) to some it means: less meat in the household, elimination of a phone (which regardless of your opinion, some only have 1 cell phone or land line) for an emergency, the money need for gas to get to work, pay a higher co-pay for health care, etc.

It would be a beautiful thing if everyone had the same income across the board but that is not how life works.

I have talked with many neighbors, seniors, lay-off victims, people barely able to keep their homes in the community. And I do not fault them for the need to vote the way they did. I abhor people who would chastise them for it. It is a tough call and not one they might have made had their personal home incomes were different.

Lets put the blame where it belongs - not just little Monroe community. There are BIG problems with our Govt and how things are being managed and the trickle down economics affect every one. And the fact the public was kept in the dark regarding the misspending the school system.
Many divorces come from undisclosed financial problems. The community has filed a separation of sorts (metaphoric only) from the schools. They need to show remorse, a plan of action to enact changes and show ALL are wanting to be invested in fixing this mess. Unfortunately, our leaders still have not offered to dig into their own pockets to help fix the problem but insist we pay them out and allow them to keep their positions with full salaries intact.
And that is NOT acceptable.
JMO!
quote:
[i]Originally posted by vegasmayor[/i]
[br]I'm still a little baffled by the "people cannot afford it" argument. So what do those people do in a good economy? Like when the value of their house it at an all time high and their taxes go up likewise. How do they afford to pay the higher taxes? Do they get automatic pay raises or a higher social security check? And you can't say, "because they have more equity in their house due to higher home value." Just because the value goes up, that doesn't put cash into your bank account until you sell. Sooooo, these people that cannot afford the levy are rooting for home values to go down so they can pay less tax??





You'll have to pardon me for being a little touchy on this subject but I have a divorce, job loss and foreclosure in my somewhat recent past. Do you? Are you speaking from experience? Because I am.

Life hands us all crap from time to time. How you respond varies from person to person. The reason I can afford the extra $20-$30 per month didn't happen by chance. I fought for every penny, for a job, rebuilt my credit and got to where I am now. Please don't discount people like me or our efforts by brushing it off and explaining that others are not in the same position. I realize that. That is EXACTLY why I did EVERYTHING in power to get to where I am.

Seniors are a little different. However you'll have to explain to my parents (seniors) how their gas, food and medical goes down as the economy improves, because it's not happening for them that way. The economy is improving and the cost of food and groceries is climbing as well.

The fact is we all have to make sacrifices from time to time. It may suck but it's necessary. "Cannot" is easily used as a cop out.



Agreed. Everyone gets to the financial circumstances they are in through their own choices for the most part. There are a few exceptions such as an illness that is not self inflicted, or a truly innocent party of a divorce. The past choices of study, career, spending habits, and saving habits all matter to the final outcome.
Bob Kelley Posted - 08/08/2012 : 2:52:12 PM
http://www.mainstreetmonroe.com/articles/monroe-3-year-teacher-contract-approved-by-school-board


The new salary schedule is projected to save the school district over $93,000 per year. Payroll runs approximately $500,000 per pay period or $13 Million per year according to School Treasurer Kelley Thorpe. The cut represents a $93000 or approximately 0.7% savings off the total payroll expense. This is significant since payroll expense has risen most of the years since the district was originally formed in 2000.

The teachers salary schedule was revised from a 5.25 percent step to a 2.75 percent step with a 1 percent increase over the entire three year contract. This means teachers for example, during their first 15 years of employment with Monroe Local Schools, would recieve only 3.75% increase in the first year of this contract and then only 2.75 percent for each of years two and three of the contract. This represents a 2.5% savings per teacher per year of the contract. Additionally, the agreement moves first year teacher base level from $34,000 to $38,000 a year.

quote:
Originally posted by Mike_Irwin

Can we all accept the vote and move on.


I have asked why the union will not give any concessions in the contract (as some other school districts have) to help get us out of this situation.


MRI

vegasmayor Posted - 08/08/2012 : 2:48:51 PM
Well said, Mike.
Mike_Irwin Posted - 08/08/2012 : 2:41:08 PM
Can we all accept the vote and move on.

VegasMayor points out, as I have in the past, we still have to pay 3.1 million back to the bond fund.

The question is HOW? 3.1 million is not $11 million that this levy would collect. We still have to now acknowledge that the items being paid for from the bond fund MUST be paid out of the GENERAL FUND.

We still have costs that continue to rise for the schools.

HOWEVER, this is not the place to solve these problems. I am frustrated by the apparent lack of transparency of the BOE and Administration. I am frustrated that it APPEARS (at least publicly) that the BOE and Superintendent is doing nothing to lower costs of existing contracts (bus, copy equipment, unions, etc.); doing nothing concerning past auditors (going back to 2005 or earlier) and other issues.

I hear how the BOE cut 2.2 million; yet the approved budget for 2013-2014 seems to have risen by a significant amount.

I am frustrated that we still haven't charged comparable rates for extra-curricular from those participating (INCLUDING non-sports); when compared to other school districts.

I am frustrated when I hear 'threats' of we will see the State forcing CANCELLING extra-curricular activities; doing away with specific programs and other 'threats' (combining with Middletown) WITHOUT any foundation - words only.

I still believe we need to fund these items (past purchases and return income to bond fund). However, HOW we fund them is the issue.

I have spoken with several board members with suggestions and questions over the past months. Even as late as today.

I have asked why we claim 2.2 million in cuts and for an actual accounting of them. I asked today how many Administrators we actually have; including those part-time and contracted out.

I have asked why the union will not give any concessions in the contract (as some other school districts have) to help get us out of this situation.

I implore every one here to contact the BOE and ask questions, make suggestions, try to face the expenses facing us, the public and come up with suggestions that can solve our problems and MOVE forward.

The question concerning the November levy issue is can it be based on more than generalities; facts backing how the money will be used responsibly.

It seems as simple as that.

MRI
zapp2525 Posted - 08/08/2012 : 2:38:56 PM
We were in the hole before the first hole was dug.

Fan fn tastic
Mike_Irwin Posted - 08/08/2012 : 2:24:25 PM
It isn't a question of NOT keeping it running.

Rather it is how the school has been ran since it broke away from Middletown.

Just to throw out an interesting statistic:
  • Public approved $29 million bond levy to build that new school complex on the hill.

    • Original bid was for $29.8 million (from Tom B. today)
    • Actual cost to build around $34 million (also from Tom B. today)

So let me see, the public approved $29 million and the actual cost was approximately $5 million more than approved by the public.

The reason why this is true is irrelevant - the fact is we (the collective body of Monroe Local Schools) spent more than authorized by the public.

Seems that we started in the hole without anticipation of future costs.

Of course add the other costs for sports complex, etc. - again without public approval.

Until this crisis arose, most people thought we were doing OK (like we were told by the school district) and although we consistently overspent (year after year) all was obviously OK.

MRI
vegasmayor Posted - 08/08/2012 : 2:24:03 PM
HHVR,

Honest question. Not trying to bait you. I honestly wonder, how do you think this debt is going to be paid? We can all agree that we are in a mess. We can all agree that there is blame and if we could do it differently, we would. But starting from where we are now, how do you think the debt should be paid? It's A LOT of money.
vegasmayor Posted - 08/08/2012 : 2:16:39 PM
quote:
[i]Originally posted by Happy HarperValley Rez[/i]
[br]And I am still baffled by the people who refuse to understand that some people cannot afford it! Seniors are on a fixed income. As the economy gets better, their out of pockets expenses (gas, food, medical costs) naturally reduce somewhat. Also, their investments (pensions, stocks, 401k plans) see a boost - thus giving them more options and more cash. A boost in the economy does lead to larger raises for some, job opportunities for the unemployed, single income households have an opportunity to become 2 income households again, the housing foreclosures would be reduced and the people have options to invest and diversify to gain income opportunities.

While $20 or $ 30 a month is nothing for you (congratulations on your good fortune) to some it means: less meat in the household, elimination of a phone (which regardless of your opinion, some only have 1 cell phone or land line) for an emergency, the money need for gas to get to work, pay a higher co-pay for health care, etc.

It would be a beautiful thing if everyone had the same income across the board but that is not how life works.

I have talked with many neighbors, seniors, lay-off victims, people barely able to keep their homes in the community. And I do not fault them for the need to vote the way they did. I abhor people who would chastise them for it. It is a tough call and not one they might have made had their personal home incomes were different.

Lets put the blame where it belongs - not just little Monroe community. There are BIG problems with our Govt and how things are being managed and the trickle down economics affect every one. And the fact the public was kept in the dark regarding the misspending the school system.
Many divorces come from undisclosed financial problems. The community has filed a separation of sorts (metaphoric only) from the schools. They need to show remorse, a plan of action to enact changes and show ALL are wanting to be invested in fixing this mess. Unfortunately, our leaders still have not offered to dig into their own pockets to help fix the problem but insist we pay them out and allow them to keep their positions with full salaries intact.
And that is NOT acceptable.
JMO!
quote:
[i]Originally posted by vegasmayor[/i]
[br]I'm still a little baffled by the "people cannot afford it" argument. So what do those people do in a good economy? Like when the value of their house it at an all time high and their taxes go up likewise. How do they afford to pay the higher taxes? Do they get automatic pay raises or a higher social security check? And you can't say, "because they have more equity in their house due to higher home value." Just because the value goes up, that doesn't put cash into your bank account until you sell. Sooooo, these people that cannot afford the levy are rooting for home values to go down so they can pay less tax??





You'll have to pardon me for being a little touchy on this subject but I have a divorce, job loss and foreclosure in my somewhat recent past. Do you? Are you speaking from experience? Because I am.

Life hands us all crap from time to time. How you respond varies from person to person. The reason I can afford the extra $20-$30 per month didn't happen by chance. I fought for every penny, for a job, rebuilt my credit and got to where I am now. Please don't discount people like me or our efforts by brushing it off and explaining that others are not in the same position. I realize that. That is EXACTLY why I did EVERYTHING in power to get to where I am.

Seniors are a little different. However you'll have to explain to my parents (seniors) how their gas, food and medical goes down as the economy improves, because it's not happening for them that way. The economy is improving and the cost of food and groceries is climbing as well.

The fact is we all have to make sacrifices from time to time. It may suck but it's necessary. "Cannot" is easily used as a cop out.
zapp2525 Posted - 08/08/2012 : 2:14:21 PM
Why would people vote for a new campus to be built and then start crying we have no money to keep it running.

I guess some thought that once it was built no more money would be needed.


MainStreetMonroe.com Terms of Use © MainStreetMonroe.com Go To Top Of Page

Advertising Information

Main Street Monroe was started by Monroe, Ohio resident John Beagle in 1998