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John Beagle
Advanced Member
USA
8666 Posts |
 Posted - 06/26/2009 : 10:53:15 AM
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 Ok the Obama administration wants us to drive little cars referred to as 'Death Traps'. Indeed more Americans will die if the Obama administration gets its fuel economy standards met by car makers.
Have you seen the smart car, the car with no behind? Imagine getting rear ended in that thing.
With socialized health care, many older Americans will die than under the current plan. That's because socialized health care will pick and choose who gets treatment based on number of years estimated to live. Many operations will be delayed due to excessive demand. People who live in socialized health care countries come to the US for their important operations because the wait is too long or the surgery isn't available to them. Poor people who live in these countries don't have the funds to come to America for an operation, so they just die.
The massive taxes coming will kill many businesses and jobs.
Yes, the current Administration is literally out to kill more Americans. |
Main Street Monroe is news of, for and by the people of Monroe, Ohio.
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Matt_Steele
Average Member
1052 Posts |
Posted - 06/26/2009 : 11:59:26 AM
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a few thoughts
1) Have you seen Europe, they drive cars like this all of the time and there are far fewer traffic deaths in European countries than in America
2) "That's because socialized health care will pick and choose who gets treatment based on number of years estimated to live." Where is the evidence for this? Why do you think a gov't would do that compared to insurance companies!? I believe there are already laws on the books prohibiting this and this goes against the Hippocratic Oath.
3) "Poor people who live in these countries don't have the funds to come to America for an operation, so they just die." Where is the evidence for this too?!
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bobpreston
Junior Member
282 Posts |
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Posted - 06/26/2009 : 12:13:42 PM
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quote:
[i]Originally posted by Matt_Steele[/i]
[br]a few thoughts
1) Have you seen Europe, they drive cars like this all of the time and there are far fewer traffic deaths in European countries than in America
2) "That's because socialized health care will pick and choose who gets treatment based on number of years estimated to live." Where is the evidence for this? Why do you think a gov't would do that compared to insurance companies!? I believe there are already laws on the books prohibiting this and this goes against the Hippocratic Oath.
3) "Poor people who live in these countries don't have the funds to come to America for an operation, so they just die." Where is the evidence for this too?!
You really need to wake up and stop drinking the koolaid. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/251988.stm
You ever think the people in europe drive that junk because, thats all they can afford, the miles driven per-capita is way less than here, and they dont have semi-trucks in the numbers we do.
I know several people in canada that do come across the border for treatment because it takes months or years for them to get help in canada.
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John Beagle
Advanced Member
USA
8666 Posts |
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Posted - 06/26/2009 : 12:19:20 PM
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1) Have you seen Europe, they drive cars like this all of the time and there are far fewer traffic deaths in European countries than in America
Yes, I have driven in Europe including Ireland and Germany. Trucks in many countries are not allowed on the roads on Sundays. Their trucks are generally smaller. The roads are smaller.
So based on European data, you think if more Americans drive small cars, we will have fewer traffic deaths, right?
There is plenty of documentation to support my claim, for example:
This article in USA Today: People buy small cars even though they can be deadly
Excerpt: If the switch to smaller, lighter vehicles continues to grow, the result could be anywhere from dozens to thousands of traffic deaths that would have been avoided in bigger vehicles, according to fatality records and safety forecasters. The number depends on how many bigger, heavier vehicles ultimately are replaced by smaller, lighter cars.
"People are looking for ways to save fuel, and they need to know that if they decide to buy a much smaller vehicle, they are putting themselves and their families at risk," says Adrian Lund, president of the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety. IIHS, supported by auto insurance companies, follows traffic deaths closely.
Full Article: http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2007-08-19-small-cars_N.htm
Its silly to think your safe in a small car when you share the road with one of these:
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Main Street Monroe is news of, for and by the people of Monroe, Ohio.
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Matt_Steele
Average Member
1052 Posts |
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Posted - 06/26/2009 : 12:20:12 PM
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what?! People in Europe drive those cars because they are sensible, SAFE, good for the environment and do exactly what they need them to do, not because they can't afford anything else.
My argument was that it would be illegal to do anything like that here in America. We already have laws preventing that, mostly related to genectic testing.
Also, I'm not sure why you think we're adopting the European model. We're not. We're not eliminating all of the insurance companies or the option for people to have a different health care choice. |
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bobpreston
Junior Member
282 Posts |
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Posted - 06/26/2009 : 12:26:41 PM
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quote:
[i]Originally posted by Matt_Steele[/i]
[br]
Also, I'm not sure why you think we're adopting the European model. We're not. We're not eliminating all of the insurance companies or the option for people to have a different health care choice.
Tell me one company that will not dump their insurance if there is a government program.
You must be chugging the odumbo koolaid. |
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Matt_Steele
Average Member
1052 Posts |
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Posted - 06/26/2009 : 12:28:08 PM
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It's also silly to think that Obama (I mean Odumbo) is doing anything more than asking people to drive smaller cars.
Perhaps we should take a few things from the European model of transportation. There are a lot of good books out there on traffic and human behavior.
For example, one town in Sweden (I think) has no stop signs and no traffic lights. Yet there was a significant drop in traffic accidents (and this wasn't a town of like 500 people either). The point is that our traffic system allows for a lot of accidents. I can recommend a few good books if anyone is interested (I'm kind of a nerd in that I'm really interested in traffic stuff) but Anthony Downs has written a few good ones (or really one he keeps updating).
(I should point out that I'm not saying to adopt everythign from the European transportation models since I hate traffic circles and there are way too many crazy moped, er Vespa drivers over there... plus I know how worked up people get when you talk about adopting anything European)
Also, Europe has a great system of trains and more public transportation options which is something I think America needs as well. However we need to privatize it if we do, because the gov't can't run amtrak very well and there should be competing companies to keep the costs lower. |
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bobpreston
Junior Member
282 Posts |
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Posted - 06/26/2009 : 12:31:23 PM
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quote:
[i]Originally posted by Matt_Steele[/i]
[br]what?! People in Europe drive those cars because they are sensible, SAFE, good for the environment and do exactly what they need them to do, not because they can't afford anything else.
You either have never been to europe or never meet a european that tells the truth. Most in europe dont make a pot to pee in because their free health insurance insures they pay 40%+ income tax and 20%+ sales taxes. Thats why they dont move out of their parents houses and live in 300sqft apartments. |
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bobpreston
Junior Member
282 Posts |
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Posted - 06/26/2009 : 12:33:34 PM
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quote:
[i]Originally posted by Matt_Steele[/i]
[br]I However we need to privatize it if we do, because the gov't can't run amtrak very well and there should be competing companies to keep the costs lower.
Yeah but you want them to run your health care????? |
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cmsquare
Senior Member
USA
1609 Posts |
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Posted - 06/26/2009 : 12:45:29 PM
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How many Americans are dead from the war in Iraq and the conservative war mongers who invaded a country for no good reason?
Those are the needless deaths that should be upsetting you.
Oh but don't worry, "Mission Accomplished!!!" our itelligent leader told us the mission was accomplished.
I'm willing to bet far more are dead due to this unjust war than will be to these liberal policies you write about in this thread.
someone's drinking too much kool aid alright, but it's not Matt.
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10 million books read and counting....catch me if you can |
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Matt_Steele
Average Member
1052 Posts |
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John Beagle
Advanced Member
USA
8666 Posts |
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Posted - 06/26/2009 : 1:29:39 PM
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I've been to Europe, Their cost of living is much higher than ours.
For example, I have a friend who lives just north of London. He makes allot of money so he could afford this 100 year old home. It is worth 1 Million US Dollars (2006)
Its a 3 Bedroom, up and down. 2 Car unattached Garage and a huge 1/4 acre lot in the suburbs.
His house is considered new since most of the homes are 200+ yrs old. Notice that all plumbing pipes are on the outside of the home.
The average Britton can not afford a home this nice. Most dwell in cities and ride mass transit. Car ownership isn't too important for many. |
Main Street Monroe is news of, for and by the people of Monroe, Ohio.
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bigben07
Senior Member
USA
2167 Posts |
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Posted - 06/26/2009 : 2:11:26 PM
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| pretty harsh statement, people will die? who decides who lives or dies? i'm pretty sure it isn't obama or the car makers. just another scare tactic from fear mongers. |
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John Beagle
Advanced Member
USA
8666 Posts |
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Posted - 06/26/2009 : 2:20:27 PM
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Yea, ignore the facts about wrecks in small cars, go out and get a smart car. After all its named smart, so it must be. Right?
I can tell you, I would never buy one for any of my family members. Would you put your child in one?
quote:
[i]Originally posted by bigben07[/i]
[br]pretty harsh statement, people will die? who decides who lives or dies? i'm pretty sure it isn't obama or the car makers. just another scare tactic from fear mongers.
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Main Street Monroe is news of, for and by the people of Monroe, Ohio.
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cmsquare
Senior Member
USA
1609 Posts |
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Posted - 06/26/2009 : 7:29:37 PM
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Last I checked no one was forcing anyone to buy a certain type of car.
You can go buy a hummer John, maybe that will make you feel more safe.
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10 million books read and counting....catch me if you can |
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Liberal Policies Will Kill More Americans
